Ralph Rugoff:
Your video follows the adventures of the Japanese dancer Bombom, who visits Jamaica to participate in international dancehall competitions.
Jeremy Deller:
The film is a bit of fantasy, an imagined version of what her visit would be like. There are Alice in Wonderland-style elements, she gets small, she goes tall, and various crazy things happen to her. And, of course, she’s also a contestant in the competitions.
Cecilia Bengolea:
Bombom has entered Jamaican dance contests for over ten years. I met her in 2015, at the International Dancehall Queen competition in Montego Bay where I was also competing. She came up third.
Ralph Rugoff:
Does your video document the actual competitions?
Jeremy Deller:
The part of the film that shows the competitions is a two-minute documentary inserted in the middle of it, and then, afterwards, you go back to the fantasy elements.
Cecilia Bengolea:
When we went to film the competition in Jamaica, the International Dancehall Queen in Montego Bay was cancelled because there was a state of emergency due to high crime in that area. We then followed Bombom to her dance classes and parties in the evening in Kingston and Ocho Rios.
Ralph Rugoff:
How would you describe the dancehall music scene that draws your protagonist to Jamaica?
Jeremy Deller:
Its inventiveness appeals to me.
Cecilia Bengolea:
Dancehall is much more than a subgenre of the 1970s Jamaican reggae. It’s a spiritual culture, a music genre, a street dance community and, maybe more than anything, a lifestyle. The vibration of the sound systems, the song lyrics and the rhythms create unity and a global language among dancers. Although dancehall steps are originally created in Jamaica, all dancers welcome foreigners to join the dance and let them co-create their own moves. Dancehall music is the punk brother of reggae, the beat per minute is faster and “'gangster”' lifestyle is reflected in its lyrics. It is not about utopia of peace and love, dancehall is related to reggae in its rebellious attitude towards systems of exploitation.
Ralph Rugoff:
And the competitions showcase the dance styles that have developed alongside the music?
Cecilia Bengolea:
There are many schools in dancehall. There are the good vibes and fun tunes with people dancing in unison, like this utopian idea of becoming one, belonging to something that is bigger than us. But as there is a lot of competition on the island, and dancing is also a mode of self-affirmation. It’s about inventing your own expressions and tricks, which become a signature. Nowadays, in the era of post-new school dancehall, there is much more freedom, and Jamaican dancers can dance steps of old school in a new school song. And can dance male steps in a female song.
Ralph Rugoff:
How would you characterize the typical style of dance in the competitions?
Cecilia Bengolea:
Dancehall female style is mimicking self-destructive sexual actions, humorously, and dramatic. Women perform an imaginary act of rough sex, with contortions and acrobatics. Last year there was a step called Hot Up, where dancers were using real fire, pretending it came from their pussies.
Ralph Rugoff:
Does Bombom have a special signature dance move?
Cecilia Bengolea:
It’s a kind of chameleon-like thing that she does, of transforming herself with this intense concentration. Sometimes she does a very, very shaky ass while just standing in one place; everything shakes very fast, as if she were electrified. It’s almost like a supernatural state. When you achieve states like that, you become an icon in the dancehall world, because you have a real superpower. And Bombom is someone like that. She’s famous in Jamaica.
Ralph Rugoff:
How important is it for you that your protagonist is a cultural outsider, in a sense? Do you think people wonder why you didn’t feature a native Jamaican dancer?
Jeremy Deller:
The thing is, it’s good that she’s an outsider, it helps the film in a way. We’re trying to tell a story about someone’s dream to go somewhere, and about her being in an alien environment with all these strange things happening, so it makes sense that she’s not from Jamaica.
Cecilia Bengolea:
It’s important that we film someone who really loves Jamaica, but is not from there, so viewers can identify and aim to enter another world which is not theirs, like Bombom does.
Jeremy Deller:
I think it’s interesting, these moments when something happens somewhere, and people elsewhere take it up. Look at how punk music has travelled all over the globe: there’s a punk movement in every country in the world. India has a punk scene. China has a punk scene. Look at rap, it’everywhere. We should be celebrating this, should we not? For me, that’s when things get interesting when they travel. The greatest example of this for me is the appropriation and redefining of Kraftwerk by b-boys in New York in the 1970s.
Cecilia Bengolea:
I think the hybrids in culture are interesting. To compose with each other, in a Spinoza way, to aim a deep transformation with the help of a practice which, in the case of dancehall, is very inclusive. It is about spreading the love and the spirit of joy and freedom together. So, the more people do the steps in the world, the more relevant the step is. The author of this step will also become famous if everyone in the world dances her or his step. Steps in dancehall have names and meanings. We call it animistic and figurative dance because it is inspired by the elements of nature, animals, weather, everyday life. It is a multi-author dance and everyone can compose choreographies with steps authored by others. All the steps belong to the community.
Ralph Rugoff:
Low-budget special effects are part of the film’s aesthetic, like in early music videos.
Jeremy Deller:
We’re using low-budget effects because we don’t have much money for production! Actually, though, green screen is the bedrock of any special effects film. I’ve always loved the film Tommy [1975], which has some great green-screen effects in it. Hopefully, in context, it’ll look good, and it’ll look funny.
Ralph Rugoff:
You have also been shooting some live-action encounters with wildlife on the island.
Jeremy Deller:
Animals are always good in films.
Cecilia Bengolea:
We’ve been filming Bombom dancing with sharks.
Jeremy Deller:
That wasn’t done with a green screen, it was real. But most sharks are not really dangerous; I’ve swum with sharks in the Galapagos Islands.
Cecilia Bengolea:
These scenes with the sharks are important for us, especially now, considering the global ecological crisis and the extinction of many species.
Jeremy Deller:
Yeah, it’s an ecological film. It’s not about dancing and shaking bums, it’s a serious film about the environment [laughs].
Cecilia Bengolea:
A different kind of nature film. We also filmed Bombom walking in the jungle alongside the animated chameleon. She also gets eaten by the chameleon who is her jealous boyfriend. I like interspecies love fantasies.
Ralph Rugoff:
Of course, it is also a dance film, and I wondered if there are any historical examples of dance films that acted as a point of reference of inspiration for you?
Jeremy Deller:
Generally, I like videos of people dancing in nightclubs,the kind of stuff you find on YouTube; it’s a sort of vernacular filmmaking in a way. If you see people dancing, you can’t help but want to look at them. It’s the ultimate form of people watching.
Ralph Rugoff:
Why is that?
Jeremy Deller:
Obviously, it goes back a long, long way, thousands of years back: getting an idea of someone through how they dance as an early form of communication.
Cecilia Bengolea:
I like documentaries about dance, like Rise [2005] about Krump in Los Angeles and Paris Is Burning [1990].
Jeremy Deller:
That’s an absolute classic. That’s dance and social history together, isn’t it?
This text is an extended and revised version of the conversation first published in : The Infinite Mix, ed. Ralph Rugoff (London: Hayward Publishing, 2016), 154–155.